VA’s Death Book – Update

20 08 2009
Is this how we repay veterans for their patriotic service to America?

Is this how we repay veterans for their patriotic service to America?

This is a follow-up on my previous post, “DeathCare For Veterans.”

My updates are in blue.

Here’s page 21 from the Veterans Administration’s handbook, Your Life, Your Choices, on “What makes your life worth living.”

The handbook has 6 authors. The two leading or senior authors are Robert Pearlman, MD MPH, and Helene Starks, MPH.

Pearlman was among a group of bioethicists who filed an Amicus Curiae supporting the respondents (Timothy Quill, Samuel Klagsbrun, and Howard Grossman — all MDs), in a 1997 Supreme Court case, “Vacco v. Quill.” The respondents and Pearlman favor “right to die,” otherwise known as physician-assisted suicides.

The other leading author of the VA death handbook is Helene Starks. You’d be comforted (not!) in knowing that she is on record as being pro-euthanasia.

In other words, the two senior authors of this VA handbook are both in favor of euthanasia.

I read all 52 pages of the handbook. What I find most disturbing is page 21. The handbook is in pdf format, so I can’t copy & paste it onto this blog. The following is the best I can do.

While you read the text I reproduced from page 21, ask yourself this question: “What is the purpose of having a veteran ask him/herself all these questions? What’s the point?”

Read this, then tell me if this isn’t a subtle ecouragement to sick or elderly veterans to just give up on life?

After you’ve read the material below, please be sure to read the Update!

~Eowyn

…………

From p. 21 of the Veterans Administration’s death handbook, Your Life, Your Choices:

Instructions: This exercise will help you think about and express what really matters to you. For each row, check (✔) one answer to express how you would feel if this factor by itself described you.

For each the following questions, the veteran is asked what he thinks his “life like this would be“:

  • difficult but acceptable?
  • worth living,  but just barely?
  • not worth living? [the word "not" is underlined in the handbook]
  • can’t answer now?

Here are the questions:

a. I can no longer walk but get around in a wheelchair.

b. I can no longer get outside—I spend all day at home.

c. I can no longer contribute to my family’s well being.

d. I am in severe pain most of the time.

e. I have severe discomfort most of the time (such as nausea, diarrhea, or shortness of breath).

f. I rely on a feeding tube to keep me alive.

g. I rely on a kidney dialysis machine to keep me alive.

h. I rely on a breathing machine to keep me alive.

i. I need someone to help take care of me all of time.

j. I can no longer control my bladder.

k. I can no longer control my bowels.

l. I live in a nursing home.

m. I can no longer think clearly-I am confused all the time.

n. I can no longer recognize family/friends

o. I can no longer talk and be understood by others.

p. My situation causes severe emotional burden for my family (such as feeling worried or stressed all the time).

q. I am a severe financial burden on my family.

r. I cannot seem to “shake the blues.”

s. Other (write in):

At the bottom of the page is this:

Instructions: To help others make sense out of your answers, think about the following questions and be sure to explain your answers to your loved ones and health care providers.

If you checked “worth living, but just barely” for more than one factor, would a combination of these factors make your life “not worth living?” If so, which factors?
If you checked “not worth living,” does this mean that you would rather die than be kept alive?
If you checked “can’t answer now,” what information or people do you need to help you decide?

**********************

UPDATE I:

Now that you’ve read the above, which is taken from page 21 of the VA handbook, Your Life, Your Choices, let me ask you all this question:

Let’s say, a veteran is depressed and responds to Question b’s “I can no longer get outside—I spend all day at home” with “my life is not worth living.” He then, as per the handbook’s instruction, inform his loved ones and health care providers about his answer.

What are they supposed to do with this information? Put a pillow over his face and kill him? — all because, in one moment in his life while reading this Death Handbook, he thought his life is not worth living because he “spends all day at home and can no longer get outside”?

The proper and humane and respectful thing for the Veterans Administration to do is to urge any veteran who thinks his life is not worth living because he spends all day at home to IMMEDIATELY GET THERAPY FOR  HIS DEPRESSION!

There are solutions to many of the scenarios posed in this Death Book, such as:

  • Anti-depressant med and/or psychotherapy for a veteran who “can no longer get outside and spends all day at home” or who “can no longer walk but get around in a wheelchair”;
  • Family counseling for a vet who feels he “can no longer contribute to his family’s well being”;
  • Surgery to repair sphincter muscles for a vet who “can no longer control his bowels”;
  • Better pain med for a vet who is “in severe pain most of the time”;
  • Better more effective med for a vet who is in “severe discomfort most of the time (such as nausea, diarrhea, or shortness of breath).”

All of this, of course, cost money. Which is the reason for this VA Death Book’s very subtle message to vets to just give up.

The fundamental mistake is to put government in charge of health care, including veterans’ health care. Instead, if individuals — including vets — are given tax incentives in the form of “health care dollars” to spend, we can shop around for the best health care from PRIVATE healthcare providers. That, in turn, creates competition among all these private entities, which then lowers medical costs. Instead of doing that, Obama and the Dems mean to exacerbate the problem by nationalizing all health care, thereby subjecting all Americans to the VA’s brand of “health” care.

UPDATE II (8/30/09):

The Veterans Administration has removed its death book, My Life, My Choices, from the website: http://www1.va.gov/pugetsound/docs/ylyc.pdf. If one goes there, this is the message you get:

PAGE NOT FOUND: The page you are looking for is unavailable. The page name may have changed, or the page has been removed.

Interesting, uh? You think the uproar from our expose has something to do with this?

~Eowyn


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50 responses

20 08 2009
giovanniworld

Eowyn,

I posted this (below) on your previous article concerning Vets being eased into thinking about giving up. I think this entire process is very sick, and truly immoral.
———–

This really pisses me off!

I have no proof of what I’m about to write, but it sure will make you wonder.

I’m guessing that this pamphlet can be found at any VA Hospital in the country, so it’s possible that veterans (patients) pick these things up and read them either while they are staying in the hospital or during a routine visit. I can also imagine an awful lot of vets that are coming back from high intensity combat locations are in a fragile state of mind. Then they get back to the states and find out that their wife or girlfriend left them, his car was repossesed, and realizes he has very little chance of getting a job. Then he goes to the VA and some idiot hands him one of these pamphlets. He then goes home and keeps reading the pamphlet over and over until finally, he pulls the trigger.

I just went through that very sad scenario because I know we have an unusually high suicide rate in the military. So it may very well be possible that these damned pamphlets are pushing some of our fragile heroes over the edge???

Gio-

20 08 2009
Eowyn

I agree with you, Gio.

Already, our soldiers have greater numbers of post-traumatic stress syndrome and suicides. This VA death book definitely does NOT help, and likely will push soldiers who are mentally fragile over the edge completely.

Criminal what the Obama administration is doing!

20 08 2009
giovanniworld

Eowyn,

In your research could you tell when these booklets first started appearing?

This is a HUGE ISSUE and it needs to be looked into. These booklets could be the driving force behind the incredibly high suicide rates among vets.

Gio-

20 08 2009
Eowyn

According to the article by Jim Towey in the WSJ which I cited in the post “DeathCare for Veterans,” the booklet was first used in 1997. The Bush administration suppressed the booklet, but the Obama administration has resurrected it.

Here’s Towey’s article: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204683204574358590107981718.html

20 08 2009
giovanniworld

OMG!

21 08 2009
DarleneG
20 08 2009
littlemissmuffin

I had the honor of shaking the hand of and thanking a WWI veteran yesterday at the grocery store. Several people looked at me like I was crazy, but do I care? NO! This man helped to keep our country safe from harm. He deserves a thank you from everyone!

20 08 2009
giovanniworld

missmuffin,

Good for you! I’m always thanking anyone I see in a uniform and I will go up to older guys that wear a ballcap that has the name of the Sub or Ship they served on, etc, and thank them also. It drives my wife crazy and she get’s embarrassed, but I do it anyway. Not only do I get the crazy look from my wife, I get it from strangers too. Funny though, it never, ever seems crazy to those we thank. If you watch people as you thank them for their service, you will always see signs of pride show through. Even if the reaction is subtle, you can still tell it means a lot to them.

And it does mean a lot. Because of them we are a free nation. (for a little longer).

Gio-

P.S. I just re-read what you said. Wow, WWI this guy must have been waaay up there in age.

20 08 2009
DCG

Littlemiss – that’s the good thing I like about getting older, you don’t give a rats arse about what other people think as long as you believe it’s the right thing to do. I’ll thank vets myself. Doesn’t phase me that others stare like, what is she doing? Plus, I always had a thing for a man in uniform!

20 08 2009
littlemissmuffin

Gio, I may have made a mistake, but it sure looked like it said WW1 veteran on his ballcap. He was a very elderly man. I am never ashamed to thank anyone who has served our country. My hubby thinks I’m nuts, too, but he doesn’t try to stop me.

20 08 2009
DCG

panel of experts that did not include any representatives of faith groups or disability rights advocates. Well no surprise there. This is despicable!

Doctor assisted suicide is legal in my state and it just irritates me to no end. Those who support it, “well, you’d put your cat down if it were ill, right”? Can’t argue when one equates a human life on the same level as an animal (and I’m a pet owner, so I get the pain of putting an animal down). This is frightening that this country basically equates a human life at the same level of an animal.

21 08 2009
Harry Buttle

The pamphlet is a guide to helping people understand and evaluate end-of-life issues, such as a living will, something any doctor or lawyer would recommend.

From the pamphlet: Many people assume that close family members automatically know what they want. But studies have shown that spouses guess wrong over half the time about what kinds of treatment their husbands or wives would want.
You can help assure that your wishes will direct future health care decisions through the process of advance care planning.

Your comments are classic demagoguery:

Step1: make something up
Step 2: Convince yourself to believe in it fervently.
Step 3: Get mad about it.
Step 4: Get others mad about it.

What you’re doing here is outrageous, offensive and immoral. Stop it.

21 08 2009
DarleneG

Freedom of speech, dude.

He has the right to say whatever he wants, and we have the right to disagree with it.

21 08 2009
Eowyn

Harry Butt,

What “”made up” commentary are you referring to? Do be so kind as to point us to the “made up” words?

If you actually bothered to read my post, you’ll see for yourself that I copied-&-pasted the text on page 21 of the VA booklet, Your Life, Your Choices. Don’t believe me? — please go directly to the source and see for yourself: http://www1.va.gov/pugetsound/docs/ylyc.pdf

After you’ve done that, then come back here and apologize for accusing me of “classic demagoguery.” You have neither heart nor soul. It is you whom I find to be “outrageous, offensive and immoral.”

21 08 2009
giovanniworld

You not being offended by this, is immoral. Go crawl back into the hole you came from. This is what we get for electing the most radical leftist ever!

Gio-

21 08 2009
steve

DarleneG, I know you have been doing battle here lately, But I’m glad you still believe in freedom of speech. Because others would have you believe it’s free speech till you disagree with them.

21 08 2009
Jim

As prior service, USAF communications, I have serious doubt Mr. Buttle has any experience with the military in his past. For those who who would rebut someone like him, thanks.

Most of the time verbal instructions are all that is necessary for final details and when you enlist or complete OCS these are part of your file from the beginning

21 08 2009
steve

Jim, Thank you for your service…
As for Mr Butthead….well, you’ll have to forgive his ignorance, as he made a wrong turn into the twilight zone………….LOL
Steve

21 08 2009
Eowyn

Please read my “Update” to this post.

What this VA Death Handbook, Your Life, Your Choices, does is extremely subtle — and evil.

21 08 2009
Eowyn

I inserted in more “Update” to this post.

It’s information I dug up on the two leading authors of this VA Death Handbook. Both are in favor of euthanasia. Chilling!

22 08 2009
Va Death Book Images | Hot Web Trends

[...] VA's Death Book « Giovanni's WorldAlready, our soldiers have greater numbers of post-traumatic stress syndrome and suicides. This VA death book definitely does NOT help, and likely will push soldiers who are mentally fragile over the edge completely. … Read more [...]

23 08 2009
Don

Overreacting to the contents of this VA booklet will not help veterans any more than choosing to do nothing about the quality of life as one ages.

Language is a powerful tool, and the language of this pamphlet should not be interpreted to mean that it promotes the killing of veterans, human beings who have served their country and deserve to live the longest and most productive life possible. However, there are millions of people who would find living with a terminal illness, or reliance upon a respirator or a feeding tube, or absolute loss of mental awareness because of dementia to be unacceptable conditions. In those cases, people should also have the right to end their suffering and relieve their loved ones of guilt and concern, to say nothing of sorrow visited upon them every day as they watch someone they love drift away. As a veteran myself, I would choose to relieve my family of such burdens, and I’m glad that there is a guiding document that can help me prepare a legal declaration of my wishes, a document that will ensure that caregivers of all kinds will follow my wishes. The time for me to make my feelings and intentions known is now, while I have the mental faculties to declare myself without ambiguity. That is the purpose of the VA booklet, and it should never be called a Death Book, since it makes clear over and over that life is precious. Remove the politics of this issue, and give each of us the honor of making our own choices.

23 08 2009
Eowyn

Don,

First of all, thank you for your military service to our country.

You object to my calling this VA handbook a “death book.” That’s most curious because the contents of this book are about nothing other than death, via one gruesome method or another.

Pages 12-15 describe what the authors of this handbook call “situations people commonly face”: Dementia, Coma, Stroke, Terminal Illness. Pages 32-36 describe various “treatments”: Kidney dialysis, CPR, Feeding tubes, Mechanical ventilators, Hospices & palliative care. Pages 38-42 contain forms for veterans to fill, indicating whether one wants the treatment or whether one would rather “die naturally” without the treatment. The treatments are: Antibiotics (Hello? Why are vets asked if they’d rather “die naturally” without antibiotics?), Kidney dialysis, Permanent coma, Severe dementia, Severe stroke, Terminal illness.

Should I instead call this VA handbook a Dementia-Coma-Stroke-Terminal Illness Book?

As a conservative, I’m in favor of each individual having the truth, being empowered with knowledge, and exercising his/her freedom of will, of choice, and of responsibility. To that end, many years ago my husband and I drew up Living Wills and gave each other power of legal and medical attorney.

There’s a proper way to do all this. But this VA Death Book falls short. Please answer my original question posed in the Update of this post:

What is the purpose of page 21 of the handbook?

Let’s say, a veteran is depressed and responds to Question b’s “I can no longer get outside—I spend all day at home” with “my life is not worth living.” He then, as per the handbook’s instruction, inform his loved ones and health care providers about his answer.

What are they supposed to do with this information? Put a pillow over his face and kill him? — all because, in one moment in his life while reading this Death Handbook, he thought his life is not worth living because he “spends all day at home and can no longer get outside”?

The proper and humane and respectful thing for the Veterans Administration to do is to urge any veteran who thinks his life is not worth living because he spends all day at home IMMEDIATELY GET THERAPY FOR DEPRESSION!!

There are solutions to many of the scenarios posed in this Death Book. For example,

– Anti-depressant med and/or psychotherapy for a veteran who “can no longer get outside and spends all day at home” or who “can no longer walk but get around in a wheelchair”;

– Family counseling for a vet who feels he “can no longer contribute to his family’s well being”;

– Surgery to repair sphincter muscles for a vet who “can no longer control his bowels”;

– Better pain med for a vet who is “in severe pain most of the time”;

– Better more effective med for a vet who is in “severe discomfort most of the time (such as nausea, diarrhea, or shortness of breath).”

All of this, of course, cost money. Which is the reason for this VA Death Book’s very subtle message to vets to just give up.

The fundamental mistake is to put government in charge of health care, including veterans’ health care. Instead, if individuals — including vets — are given tax incentives in the form of “health care dollars” to spend, we can shop around for the best health care from PRIVATE healthcare providers. That, in turn, creates competition among all these private entities, which then lowers medical costs. Instead of doing that, Obama and the Dems mean to exacerbate the problem by nationalizing all health care, thereby subjecting all Americans to the VA’s brand of “health” care.

Shame on the VA! Shame on the Obama administration for reviving this Death Book! And shame on you for lauding this handbook.

23 08 2009
giovanniworld

“All of this, of course, cost money. Which is the reason for this VA Death Book’s very subtle message to vets to just give up.

This country could afford excellent care for all vets if the POS representatives in DC would stop spending our money as if it grows on trees. The same could be said for Social Security and Medicare.

This handbook only helps to support the idea that Obama will want end-of-life counseling to go much further than they would tell the public if he can get his Obamacare passed.

Obamacare must be stopped!

Gio-

23 08 2009
Eowyn

In the meantime, the VA pats itself on the back and lavishes $24M in bonuses on its bureaucrats and political hacks:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/22/veterans.affairs.bonuses/

23 08 2009
DCG

Good grief…and they complain about the AIG bonuses that Tax Cheat Timothy approved?

How much you want to bet this inspector general will soon be looking for another job…

23 08 2009
giovanniworld

I hope they all come down with a terminal illness the moment they deposit those bonus checks!

Gio-

23 08 2009
DCG

Don, thanks for your service – our vets are the best we have in Americans.

since it makes clear over and over that life is precious. Couldn’t agree more. I don’t know your religious background so this is coming from my Christian beliefs. I’ve had two close relatives die slowly from a terminal illness. At no point did they wish to end their lives. At no point did any member of our family consider them a burden. It was very hard visiting them, watching them in pain and hurting. Yet there were days when their eyes would light up, smile at seeing the young nieces and nephews, or just say something silly. Our family believes Jesus Christ suffered for us and as we suffer, we become closer to him. I don’t believe a terminal illness gives one the right to take their life because all life, no matter how imperfect or sickened, is precious.

Your point of having a guiding document to express your legal declaration is very valid. Everyone should have a living will.

23 08 2009
littlemissmuffin

I have a serious question:

Why do the Chinese revere their elderly, but many Americans don’t? Do people not understand how much we can learn from our elderly generation? Even just listening to their stories about their childhood is fascinating to me.

Yes, DCG, everyone, young or old, should have a living will. A living will gives you choices for the decisions you need to make. My mother passed in 2006 and fortunately she left a living will. I, being an only child, would have had to make those decisions for her because she slipped into a coma. She had the foresight to take those decisions out of my hands, and I will be ever grateful to her for that. I simply followed her wishes and I feel no guilt.

23 08 2009
giovanniworld

Forget their politics for a moment, but the Chinese have always seen the wisdom of learning wisdom from their elderly. Far too many Americans see the elderly as a burden, which to no suprprise I’m sure, I blame on liberal ideology!

Fortunately, those that have a religious background honor and respect their elders more than most. The left seems to think they are a bother and a drain on resources. Something that has always confused me…. the left doesn’t want us to rely on God, they want us to rely on government instead, but they love to play God with their proclamations as to how we should all live.

Gio-

23 08 2009
DCG

Good question…I think the large amount of divorced families may play a role. Many families end up dispersed…out of state, out of touch, or then in another family unit. For self preservation, many children must learn to think of themselves first.

At my last family reunion (my dad is the youngest of 12 kids so there’s plenty family!), it was the older generations conversing, looking through photo albums, and reminiscing of those who had passed on. The younger generation was all over their electronics – texting, taking dig pics, or on the Wii. Heck, my 15 yo niece prefers to “talk” to her friends on Facebook/texting rather than the phone…They prefer the “new” rather than the “old”.

23 08 2009
giovanniworld

DCG,

Or the classic…. My granddaughter has texted her girlfriend who is sitting next to her?!

Go figure.

Gio-

23 08 2009
Eowyn

MissMuffin,

Sorry to burst your balloon, but this belief that the Chinese revere their elderly is really dated. Sadly, there’s no evidence that contemporary Chinese still revere their elderly.

China has no respect for life. It has the world’s record on the greatest # of abortions (forced and voluntary), of 13 million abortions each year (vs. 20 million births). Researchers believe the real figure could be even higher because there are many abortions at unregistered clinics.

China’s abortion rate of 24 per 1,000 woman of childbearing age is far from the top of the international list. According to UN figures, Russia is highest with more than 50. The US has 15 and Spain just under 12.

One lamentable result of the Chinese government’s one-child-per-couple population control policy is the intentional abortion — and infanticide — of female babies, due to the persistent cultural preference for males. That, in turn, has led to an extremely skewed gender birth ratio and an alarming number of excess adult males who have no hope of finding a wife.

The curse of unintentional consequences….

23 08 2009
giovanniworld

Eowyn,

My bubble has been popped also.

Gio-

23 08 2009
Eowyn

Sorry to shatter illusions.

For now we see through a glass, darkly….

23 08 2009
littlemissmuffin

Thanks, Eowyn, for the information. I am saddened by everything you wrote.

24 08 2009
Don

Eowyn:

You assert that the language of the VA booklet is “about nothing but death.” Well, the purpose of the booklet is to promote the creation of Living Wills and Durable Powers of Attorney, which are instruments needed around the time that death might occur, so it’s going to have to be viewed as if death were a subject on the minds of those who read it. A healthy individual without quality of life concerns would have little incentive to consider the VA pamphlet, it seems to me. I think you have misinterpreted the intentions of the booklet, which should serve only as a guide for the preparation of a Living Will or Durable Power of Attorney for healthcare purposes. To say that this is a Death Book designed to encourage vets to choose death over life is simply to view the world “through a glass darkly” indeed.

Bear with me: What if we viewed the language of the VA booklet from the point of view of the patients who are incapacitated, not just depressed, or incontinent? What if we chose to view the language of the VA booklet as if those who wrote it were COMPASSIONATE toward patients, and not people hell bent on killing? Maybe, just maybe, they’re NOT suggesting that death is the goal or intention of the questionnaire. I submit that the reaction to the booklet would be very different.

Glenn Beck should not be the lens through which we view this situation. I hasten to remind those who support him that he is not a man who wore his country’s uniform, and his love of guns should not be a reason to believe every word he utters. As a vet, I’ll make my own decisions, and I will base those decisions on research I conduct myself, rather than accepting the assertions–some of them simply wild and extreme–of others.

Let’s be honest and ask ourselves what role hatred and distrust play in this situation. Are we to believe that doctors sworn to uphold the value of life, doctors whose profession calls for sustaining life in the most productive way possible, are going to embark on a willful plan to kill vets, just as the Right asserts that healthcare reform would lead to the death of elderly people all around the country through euthanasia? We’re supposed to believe that this is going to happen because the “liberals” are in charge of government? Are we out of our minds? If Liberals were truly in charge, then the healthcare reform Obama seeks would already be in place. Instead, the Republicans and Blue Dog Democrats are impeding progress toward healthcare reform because they’ve joined hands with the insurance industry, and that’s going to cost all of us much more money, not less, as time goes on. Are we to distrust doctors and caregivers and the VA simply because reforms are being proposed by a Democratic president and Congress? Did we distrust the prior administration when they installed a Prescription Drug Provision into the Medicare bill without paying a single penny toward its cost at the time? To quote Glenn Beck’s network, is that fair and balanced?

24 08 2009
Eowyn

Don,

I appreciate your civility. And I, once again, thank you for your military service to our country.

However, I do take umbrage at your assertion that I take marching orders from Glenn Beck. I discovered the VA death book on my own. In fact, if you check your dates, you’ll see that this post, “VA’s Death Post,” pre-dates Fox News’ coverage on the handbook, as well as Rush Limbaugh’s (whom I just heard, while doing my morning walk, lampooning the handbook).

FYI, I don’t even have cable TV service. The first and only time I actually saw Glenn Beck on TV was when I went to my first “tea party.” I, therefore, politely ask that you retract that assertion.

As for the rest of your comment:

1. I had already said I don’t object but actually favor we make Living Wills. That was in my first response to you yesterday. What I object to is the VA handbook’s method of having our veterans think about end-of-life decisions. So, please stop insinuating that I object to Living Wills already.

2. You still have not responded to my query about page 21 of the VA death book.

Finally, a head’s up:

If you, in a future comment, again repeat yourself, I will no longer respond to you because doing so will mean I will repeat myself as well — which is a huge waste of time that I don’t have to squander.

Take care of yourself.

24 08 2009
Don

By the way, Eowyn, I see Pages 21 and following very differently than you do, it would seem. I don’t see a governmental conspiracy to kill vets, and I don’t think that’s the intention at all, but you’re entitled to hold your opinion.

If one is inclined to see an evil or lethal intent in this VA booklet, then they will see it. I, for one–having served as a Corpsman and having a high respect for human life–believe that the underlying goal is not to kill, but to prepare vets and their families for a time when the patient might not be able to make any decisions for themselves. Simply because the questionnaire allows us to fill in our responses to each question does not mean that a vet in need of antibiotics, for example, would not receive drugs as needed. The questionnaire, in my opinion, is a survey of attitudes, opinions and beliefs held by a vet at the time the issue of Advance Directives is being considered.

And as a matter of fact, I can envision situations and conditions in which a vet would not be able to determine for himself whether the administration of antibiotics should be done, as elementary as that might seem. If a vet wants those antibiotics in an effort to sustain his life, he should direct such things to be done, and the only way is to have a Living Will that examines even such basic interventions as antibiotics. There are lots of questions in this VA booklet that are intended to elicit a response from vets, but the underlying purpose of those questions is to take us into the concept of prolonging life so we can analyze our situation, each according to his or her own beliefs and personal wishes.

Call me an optimist, but I just don’t see the lethal conspiracy that so many others have asserted. And I don’t believe I should be made to feel “shame” for discussing this VA booklet in objective terms, which is what I’m trying to do. Those who care about independence of thought and the liberties for which our nation stands would be careful before accusing someone such as myself of “lauding” a document simply because I don’t fall in and salute someone else’s opinions. I wish you all the best.

24 08 2009
Eowyn

Don,

My apologies for saying “Shame on you for lauding this handbook.”

Now, I await your apology for saying I take my marching orders from Glenn Beck!

24 08 2009
giovanniworld

Don,

Although I respect you for your service, I kinda feel sorry for you. If you don’t understand the implications on page 21 then somewhere along the road of life, someone has seriously screwed with your head.

I wish you luck.

Gio-

24 08 2009
Don

You can review my post for verification. My statement was that “Glenn Beck should not be the lens through which we view this situation” and I told “those who support him” [If that pertains to you, then you read that fact into my words, I didn't assert that about you per se] that he “never wore his country’s uniform.”

I stand by both statements, with no apology required or forthcoming.

I’ve said my piece, and I know that the truth will come out as it should. Others can argue this to the point of nausea, if they choose. I wish everyone a good life, and all the best with their decisions. Don

24 08 2009
Eowyn

Boy, you’re some classy guy.

Since you’re big on people viewing matters through their individual “lenses,” I, too, stand by my original statement: “Shame on you for lauding the VA’s death book!” Afterall, everything is relative as we all perceive the world through our own “lenses.”

Of course, your very statement that we view things through our own lenses is itself relativistic and uncompelling — because you’re merely viewing epistemology (the nature of truths) through your own lenses.

That pesky Mannheim’s Paradox will get you every time.

24 08 2009
DCG

the purpose of the booklet is to promote the creation of Living Wills and Durable Powers of Attorney

Then why didn’t the VA create a 10-page booklet, “How to Create a Living Will and Durable Powers of Attorney”? Simple as that -include sample documents and the phone number of a paralegal they can contact in the VA. Give the booklet to everyone once they first arrive at the VA. You don’t need 52 pages of questions about how you feel about the quality of your life to explain how to create a living will or power of attorney.

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